King Hui of Liang

Mencius went to see king Hui of Liang. The king said, 'Venerable sir, since you have not counted it far to come here, a distance of a thousand li, may I presume that you are provided with counsels to profit my kingdom?'

Mencius went to see king Hui of Liang. The king said, 'Respected sir, you have not considered a thousand li too far to travel here. Since you have come this far, may I assume you have advice that will benefit my kingdom?'

Mencius replied, 'Why must your Majesty use that word "profit?" What I am provided with, are counsels to benevolence and righteousness, and these are my only topics. 'If your Majesty say, "What is to be done to profit my kingdom?" the great officers will say, "What is to be done to profit our families?" and the inferior officers and the common people will say, "What is to be done to profit our persons?" Superiors and inferiors will try to snatch this profit the one from the other, and the kingdom will be endangered. In the kingdom of ten thousand chariots, the murderer of his sovereign shall be the chief of a family of a thousand chariots. In the kingdom of a thousand chariots, the murderer of his prince shall be the chief of a family of a hundred chariots. To have a thousand in ten thousand, and a hundred in a thousand, cannot be said not to be a large allotment, but if righteousness be put last, and profit be put first, they will not be satisfied without snatching all. There never has been a benevolent man who neglected his parents. There never has been a righteous man who made his sovereign an after consideration. Let your Majesty also say, "Benevolence and righteousness, and let these be your only themes." Why must you use that word - "profit?".'

Mencius replied, 'Why must your Majesty use the word "profit?" I offer advice only on benevolence and righteousness. These are my only topics. 'If your Majesty says, "How can I profit my kingdom?" the high officials will say, "How can we profit our families?" The lower officials and common people will say, "How can we profit ourselves?" Those above and below will try to seize profit from one another, and the kingdom will be in danger. 'In a kingdom with ten thousand chariots, the ruler’s murderer will head a family with a thousand chariots. In a kingdom with a thousand chariots, the prince’s murderer will head a family with a hundred chariots. A thousand out of ten thousand, or a hundred out of a thousand, is certainly a large share. But if these family heads put righteousness last and profit first, they will not be satisfied until they seize everything. 'No benevolent person has ever neglected his parents. No righteous person has ever treated his ruler as an afterthought. Let your Majesty also say, "Benevolence and righteousness," and make these your only topics. Why must you use the word "profit?"'

Mencius, another day, saw King Hui of Liang. The king went and stood with him by a pond, and, looking round at the large geese and deer, said, 'Do wise and good princes also find pleasure in these things?'

On another day, Mencius visited King Hui of Liang. The king joined him beside a pond and looked around at the large geese and deer. He asked, 'Do wise and good rulers also take pleasure in these things?'

Mencius replied, 'Being wise and good, they have pleasure in these things. If they are not wise and good, though they have these things, they do not find pleasure. It is said in the Book of Poetry, "He measured out and commenced his marvellous tower; He measured it out and planned it. The people addressed themselves to it, And in less than a day completed it. When he measured and began it, he said to them - Be not so earnest: But the multitudes came as if they had been his children. The king was in his marvellous park; The does reposed about, The does so sleek and fat: And the white birds came glistening. The king was by his marvellous pond; How full was it of fishes leaping about!" King Wen used the strength of the people to make his tower and his pond, and yet the people rejoiced to do the work, calling the tower "the marvellous tower," calling the pond "the marvellous pond," and rejoicing that he had his large deer, his fishes, and turtles. The ancients caused the people to have pleasure as well as themselves, and therefore they could enjoy it. In the Declaration of Tang it is said, "O sun, when wilt thou expire? We will die together with thee." The people wished for Jie's death, though they should die with him. Although he had towers, ponds, birds, and animals, how could he have pleasure alone?'

Mencius replied, 'Because they are wise and good, they enjoy these things. If they are not wise and good, they find no pleasure in these things, even though they possess them. The Book of Poetry says, "He marked out the site for his marvellous tower and began building. He measured and planned it. The people set to work and finished it in less than a day. When he marked out the site and began, he told them, Do not hurry. But the crowds came as if they were his children. The king was in his marvellous park. The does rested around him, so sleek and fat. The white birds arrived, their feathers gleaming. The king stood beside his marvellous pond. How full it was of leaping fish!" King Wen used the people's labor to build his tower and pond. Yet the people were happy to do the work. They called the tower "the marvellous tower" and the pond "the marvellous pond." They rejoiced that he had his large deer, fish, and turtles. The ancient rulers gave the people pleasure as well as themselves. That was why the rulers could enjoy these things. The Declaration of Tang says, "O sun, when will you burn out? We will die with you." The people wished for Jie's death, even if they had to die with him. Although he had towers, ponds, birds, and animals, how could he enjoy them alone?'

King Hui of Liang said, 'Small as my virtue is, in the government of my kingdom, I do indeed exert my mind to the utmost. If the year be bad on the inside of the river, I remove as many of the people as I can to the east of the river, and convey grain to the country in the inside. When the year is bad on the east of the river, I act on the same plan. On examining the government of the neighboring kingdoms, I do not find that there is any prince who exerts his mind as I do. And yet the people of the neighboring kingdoms do not decrease, nor do my people increase. How is this?'

King Hui of Liang said, 'Though I have little virtue, I truly give my full attention to governing my kingdom. If the harvest is poor in the region inside the river, I move as many people as I can east of the river. I also send grain to the region inside the river. When the harvest is poor east of the river, I follow the same plan. When I examine how neighboring kingdoms are governed, I find no ruler who gives as much attention as I do. Yet the populations of neighboring kingdoms do not shrink, and my population does not grow. Why is that?'

Mencius replied, 'Your majesty is fond of war - let me take an illustration from war. The soldiers move forward to the sound of the drums; and after their weapons have been crossed, on one side they throw away their coats of mail, trail their arms behind them, and run. Some run a hundred paces and stop; some run fifty paces and stop. What would you think if those who run fifty paces were to laugh at those who run a hundred paces?'

Mencius replied, 'Your Majesty, you are fond of war. Let me use an example from war. Soldiers advance to the sound of drums. After the fighting begins, soldiers on one side throw off their armor and run, dragging their weapons behind them. Some run a hundred paces and stop. Some run fifty paces and stop. What would you think if those who ran fifty paces laughed at those who ran a hundred paces?'

The king said, 'They should not do so. Though they did not run a hundred paces, yet they also ran away.'

The king said, 'They should not do that. Although they did not run a hundred paces, they still ran away.'

'Since your Majesty knows this,' replied Mencius, 'you need not hope that your people will become more numerous than those of the neighboring kingdoms. If the seasons of husbandry be not interfered with, the grain will be more than can be eaten. If close nets are not allowed to enter the pools and ponds, the fishes and turtles will be more than can be consumed. If the axes and bills enter the hills and forests only at the proper time, the wood will be more than can be used. When the grain and fish and turtles are more than can be eaten, and there is more wood than can be used, this enables the people to nourish their living and mourn for their dead, without any feeling against any. This condition, in which the people nourish their living and bury their dead without any feeling against any, is the first step of royal government. Let mulberry trees be planted about the homesteads with their five mu, and persons of fifty years may be clothed with silk. In keeping fowls, pigs, dogs, and swine, let not their times of breeding be neglected, and persons of seventy years may eat flesh. Let there not be taken away the time that is proper for the cultivation of the farm with its hundred mu, and the family of several mouths that is supported by it shall not suffer from hunger. Let careful attention be paid to education in schools, inculcating in it especially the filial and fraternal duties, and grey-haired men will not be seen upon the roads, carrying burdens on their backs or on their heads. It never has been that the ruler of a State, where such results were seen - persons of seventy wearing silk and eating flesh, and the black-haired people suffering neither from hunger nor cold - did not attain to the royal dignity.'

'Since your Majesty knows this,' replied Mencius, 'you should not expect your people to become more numerous than those of neighboring kingdoms. If farming is not disrupted during its proper seasons, there will be more grain than people can eat. If fine-meshed nets are kept out of pools and ponds, there will be more fish and turtles than people can consume. If axes and cutting tools enter the hills and forests only at the proper time, there will be more wood than people can use. With more than enough grain, fish, turtles, and wood, people can support the living and mourn the dead without resentment. Supporting the living and burying the dead without resentment is the first step toward kingly rule. Let mulberry trees be planted around homesteads of five mu, and people aged fifty may wear silk. When raising chickens, pigs, dogs, and swine, do not neglect their breeding seasons, and people aged seventy may eat meat. Do not take away the time needed to cultivate a farm of a hundred mu. Then the family with several mouths that the farm supports will not go hungry. Pay careful attention to education in schools, especially teaching duties toward parents and older siblings. Then gray-haired men will not be seen on the roads carrying loads on their backs or heads. No ruler has ever failed to become a true king when his state has achieved these results: people aged seventy wear silk and eat meat, and the black-haired people suffer neither hunger nor cold.'

'Your dogs and swine eat the food of men, and you do not make any restrictive arrangements. There are people dying from famine on the roads, and you do not issue the stores of your granaries for them. When people die, you say, "It is not owing to me; it is owing to the year." In what does this differ from stabbing a man and killing him, and then saying - "It was not I; it was the weapon?" Let your Majesty cease to lay the blame on the year, and instantly from all the nation the people will come to you.'

'Your dogs and pigs eat food meant for people, and you do nothing to stop them. People are dying of hunger on the roads, and you do not open your grain stores to feed them. When people die, you say, "I am not to blame. The poor harvest is to blame." How is that different from stabbing a man to death and then saying, "I did not kill him. The weapon did"? Your Majesty, stop blaming the poor harvest, and people from all across the nation will immediately come to you.'

King Hui of Liang said, 'I wish quietly to receive your instructions.'

King Hui of Liang said, 'I would like to listen quietly to your guidance.'

Mencius replied, 'Is there any difference between killing a man with a stick and with a sword ?'

Mencius replied, 'Is there any difference between killing a man with a stick and killing him with a sword?'

The king said, 'There is no difference!'

The king said, 'There’s no difference!'

'Is there any difference between doing it with a sword and with the style of government?'

'Is there any difference between doing it with a sword and doing it through government policies?'

'There is no difference,' was the reply.

'There is no difference,' came the reply.

Mencius then said, 'In your kitchen there is fat meat; in your stables there are fat horses. But your people have the look of hunger, and on the wilds there are those who have died of famine. This is leading on beasts to devour men. Beasts devour one another, and men hate them for doing so. When a prince, being the parent of his people, administers his government so as to be chargeable with leading on beasts to devour men, where is his parental relation to the people? Zhong Ni said, "Was he not without posterity who first made wooden images to bury with the dead?" So he said, because that man made the semblances of men, and used them for that purpose - what shall be thought of him who causes his people to die of hunger?'

Mencius then said, 'Your kitchen has rich meat, and your stables have well-fed horses. But your people look hungry, and out in the countryside, people have died of famine. This is leading beasts to devour people. Beasts devour one another, and people hate them for it. A ruler is the parent of his people. But suppose he governs in a way that makes him guilty of leading beasts to devour people. How is he acting as their parent? Zhong Ni said, "Did not the man who first made wooden figures to bury with the dead leave no descendants?" He said this because the man made figures resembling people and used them for burial. What, then, should we think of a ruler who causes his people to die of hunger?'

King Hui of Liang said, 'There was not in the nation a stronger State than Jin, as you, venerable Sir, know. But since it descended to me, on the east we have been defeated by Qi, and then my eldest son perished; on the west we have lost seven hundred li of territory to Qin; and on the south we have sustained disgrace at the hands of Chu. I have brought shame on my departed predecessors, and wish on their account to wipe it away, once for all. What course is to be pursued to accomplish this?'

King Hui of Liang said, 'As you know, honored Sir, no state in the nation was stronger than Jin. But since I inherited Jin, we have been defeated in the east by Qi, and then my eldest son died. In the west, we have lost seven hundred li of territory to Qin. In the south, we have suffered humiliation at the hands of Chu. I have brought shame on my late predecessors. For their sake, I want to wipe away that shame once and for all. What should I do to accomplish this?'

Mencius replied, 'With a territory which is only a hundred li square, it is possible to attain to the royal dignity. If Your Majesty will indeed dispense a benevolent government to the people, being sparing in the use of punishments and fines, and making the taxes and levies light, so causing that the fields shall be ploughed deep, and the weeding of them be carefully attended to, and that the strong-bodied, during their days of leisure, shall cultivate their filial piety, fraternal respectfulness, sincerity, and truthfulness, serving thereby, at home, their fathers and elder brothers, and, abroad, their elders and superiors, you will then have a people who can be employed, with sticks which they have prepared, to oppose the strong mail and sharp weapons of the troops of Qin and Chu. The rulers of those States rob their people of their time, so that they cannot plough and weed their fields, in order to support their parents. Their parents suffer from cold and hunger. Brothers, wives, and children are separated and scattered abroad. Those rulers, as it were, drive their people into pit-falls, or drown them. Your Majesty will go to punish them. In such a case, who will oppose your Majesty? In accordance with this is the saying, "The benevolent has no enemy." I beg your Majesty not to doubt what I say.'

Mencius replied, 'With a territory only a hundred li square, you can rise to the rank of king. If Your Majesty truly governs the people with kindness, use punishments and fines sparingly, and keep taxes and levies light. In this way, let the fields be ploughed deeply and weeded carefully. Let the able-bodied use their free time to develop respect for parents and older brothers, sincerity, and honesty. Through these virtues, let them serve their fathers and older brothers at home, and their elders and superiors outside. Then your people, armed with sticks they have prepared, can face the heavy armor and sharp weapons of Qin and Chu. 'The rulers of those states rob their people of the time needed to plough and weed their fields. So the people cannot support their parents. Their parents suffer from cold and hunger. Brothers, wives, and children are separated and scattered far from home. Those rulers are, in effect, driving their people into pits or drowning them. Your Majesty will go to punish those rulers. In such a case, who will oppose Your Majesty? This agrees with the saying, "The benevolent person has no enemy." I beg Your Majesty not to doubt what I say.'

Mencius went to see the king Xiang of Liang. On coming out from the interview, he said to some persons, 'When I looked at him from a distance, he did not appear like a sovereign; when I drew near to him, I saw nothing venerable about him. Abruptly he asked me, "How can the kingdom be settled?" I replied, "It will be settled by being united under one sway."

Mencius went to see king Xiang of Liang. After the meeting, he said to some people, 'From a distance, he did not look like a ruler. When I came closer, I saw nothing about him that commanded respect. He abruptly asked me, "How can the kingdom be brought to peace?" I replied, "The kingdom will find peace when it is united under one ruler."

'"Who can so unite it?" I replied, "He who has no pleasure in killing men can so unite it."'

'"Who can unite it?" I replied, "A man who takes no pleasure in killing people can unite it."'

'"Who can give it to him?" I replied, " All the people of the nation will unanimously give it to him. Does your Majesty understand the way of the growing grain? During the seventh and eighth months, when drought prevails, the plants become dry. Then the clouds collect densely in the heavens, they send down torrents of rain, and the grain erects itself, as if by a shoot. When it does so, who can keep it back? Now among the shepherds of men throughout the nation, there is not one who does not find pleasure in killing men. If there were one who did not find pleasure in killing men, all the people in the nation would look towards him with outstretched necks. Such being indeed the case, the people would flock to him, as water flows downwards with a rush, which no one can repress."'

'"Who can give it to him?" I replied, "All the people of the nation will agree to give it to him. Does your Majesty understand how grain grows? During the seventh and eighth months, when drought strikes, the plants dry out. Then thick clouds gather in the sky and pour down rain. The grain springs upright, as if shooting up. When the grain grows like this, who can hold it back? Now, among the rulers throughout the nation, not one takes no pleasure in killing people. If there were one who took no pleasure in killing people, everyone in the nation would crane their necks toward him. If that were indeed the case, the people would flock to him like water rushing downhill. No one could stop them."'

The king Xuan of Qi asked, saying, 'May I be informed by you of the transactions of Huan of Qi, and Wen of Jin?'

King Xuan of Qi asked, 'Could you tell me about the deeds of Huan of Qi and Wen of Jin?'

Mencius replied, 'There were none of the disciples of Zhong Ni who spoke about the affairs of Huan and Wen, and therefore they have not been transmitted to these after-ages - your servant has not heard them. If you will have me speak, let it be about royal government.'

Mencius replied, 'None of Zhong Ni’s disciples spoke about the affairs of Huan and Wen. So accounts of those affairs have not been passed down to later generations. I, your servant, have not heard them. If you want me to speak, let me speak about royal government.'

The king said, 'What virtue must there be in order to attain to royal sway?'

The king said, 'What virtue is needed to gain royal power?'

Mencius answered, 'The love and protection of the people; with this there is no power which can prevent a ruler from attaining to it.'

Mencius answered, 'Love and protect the people. By loving and protecting them, a ruler can attain it, and no power can stop him.'

The king asked again, 'Is such an one as I competent to love and protect the people?'

The king asked again, 'Is someone like me capable of loving and protecting the people?'

Mencius said, 'Yes.'

Mencius said, 'Yes.'

'How do you know that I am competent for that?'

'How do you know I’m capable of that?'

'I heard the following incident from Hu He: "The king," said he, "was sitting aloft in the hall, when a man appeared, leading an ox past the lower part of it. The king saw him, and asked, Where is the ox going? The man replied, We are going to consecrate a bell with its blood. The king said, Let it go. I cannot bear its frightened appearance, as if it were an innocent person going to the place of death. The man answered, Shall we then omit the consecration of the bell ? The king said, How can that be omitted? Change it for a sheep." I do not know whether this incident really occurred.'

'I heard the following story from Hu He: "The king was sitting high up in the hall," he said. "A man came into view, leading an ox past the lower part of the hall. The king saw him and asked, Where is the ox going? The man replied, We are going to consecrate a bell with its blood. The king said, Let the ox go. I cannot bear to see it so frightened, as if it were an innocent person being led to execution. The man answered, Should we then skip the consecration of the bell? The king said, How can we skip that ceremony? Use a sheep instead." I do not know whether this really happened.'

The king replied, 'It did,'

The king answered, 'It did,'

and then Mencius said, 'The heart seen in this is sufficient to carry you to the royal sway. The people all supposed that your Majesty grudged the animal, but your servant knows surely, that it was your Majesty's not being able to bear the sight, which made you do as you did.'

Then Mencius said, 'The compassion you showed is enough to make you a true king. The people all thought Your Majesty was unwilling to spare the animal's cost. But I, your servant, know for certain that you acted because you could not bear the sight of the animal.'

The king said, 'You are right. And yet there really was an appearance of what the people condemned. But though Qi be a small and narrow State, how should I grudge one ox? Indeed it was because I could not bear its frightened appearance, as if it were an innocent person going to the place of death, that therefore I changed it for a sheep.'

The king said, 'You are right. And yet my actions really did look like what the people condemned. But though Qi is a small, narrow state, why would I begrudge a single ox? The truth is, I could not bear to see the ox so frightened, as if an innocent person faced execution. That was why I replaced the ox with a sheep.'

Mencius pursued, 'Let not your Majesty deem it strange that the people should think you were grudging the animal. When you changed a large one for a small, how should they know the true reason? If you felt pained by its being led without guilt to the place of death, what was there to choose between an ox and a sheep?

Mencius continued, 'Your Majesty, do not be surprised that the people thought you were being stingy with the animal. You replaced a large animal with a small one. How could they know your real reason? If you were distressed that an innocent animal was being led to slaughter, what difference was there between an ox and a sheep?

The king laughed and said, 'What really was my mind in the matter? I did not grudge the expense of it, and changed it for a sheep! There was reason in the people's saying that I grudged it.'

The king laughed and said, 'What was I really thinking? I wasn't worried about the cost, yet I replaced it with a sheep! The people had reason to say I was unwilling to pay.'

'There is no harm in their saying so,' said Mencius. 'Your conduct was an artifice of benevolence. You saw the ox, and had not seen the sheep. So is the superior man affected towards animals, that, having seen them alive, he cannot bear to see them die; having heard their dying cries, he cannot bear to eat their flesh. Therefore he keeps away from his slaughter-house and cook-room.'

'There is no harm in their saying so,' said Mencius. 'Your action was a way of showing compassion. You saw the ox, but you had not seen the sheep. This is how a virtuous man feels about animals. Once he has seen them alive, he cannot bear to see them die. Once he has heard their dying cries, he cannot bear to eat their flesh. That is why he stays away from his slaughterhouse and kitchen.'

The king was pleased, and said, 'It is said in the Book of Poetry, "The minds of others, I am able by reflection to measure;" - this is verified, my Master, in your discovery of my motive. I indeed did the thing, but when I turned my thoughts inward, and examined into it, I could not discover my own mind. When you, Master, spoke those words, the movements of compassion began to work in my mind. How is it that this heart has in it what is equal to the royal sway?'

The king was pleased and said, 'The Book of Poetry says, "By reflecting, I can understand the minds of others." Master, you have proved this by discovering my motive. I did indeed act that way. But when I looked within myself and examined my actions, I could not understand my own mind. When you spoke those words, Master, compassion began to stir in my heart. How does this compassion give me what I need to rule as a true king?'

Mencius replied, 'Suppose a man were to make this statement to your Majesty: "My strength is sufficient to lift three thousand catties, but it is not sufficient to lift one feather; my eyesight is sharp enough to examine the point of an autumn hair, but I do not see a waggon-load of faggots;" would your Majesty allow what he said?'

Mencius replied, 'Suppose a man said to your Majesty: "I am strong enough to lift three thousand catties, but I cannot lift a single feather. My eyesight is sharp enough to examine the tip of a fine autumn hair. But I cannot see a wagonload of firewood." Would your Majesty accept his claim?'

'No,' was the answer,

'No,' came the reply,

on which Mencius proceeded, 'Now here is kindness sufficient to reach to animals, and no benefits are extended from it to the people. How is this? Is an exception to be made here? The truth is, the feather is not lifted , because strength is not used; the waggon-load of firewood is not seen, because the eyesight is not used; and the people are not loved and protected, because kindness is not employed. Therefore your Majesty's not exercising the royal sway, is because you do not do it, not because you are not able to do it.'

Mencius continued, 'Your kindness is great enough to reach animals, yet none of its benefits reach the people. Why is that? Should an exception be made here? The truth is, the feather is not lifted because you do not use your strength. The wagonload of firewood is not seen because you do not use your eyesight. And the people are not loved and protected because you do not put your kindness to use. So, Your Majesty, you do not rule as a true king because you do not act. It is not because you lack the ability.'

The king asked, 'How may the difference between the not doing a thing, and the not being able to do it, be represented?

The king asked, 'How can you explain the difference between not doing something and being unable to do it?

Mencius replied, 'In such a thing as taking the Tai mountain under your arm, and leaping over the north sea with it, if you say to people "I am not able to do it," that is a real case of not being able. In such a matter as breaking off a branch from a tree at the order of a superior, if you say to people "I am not able to do it," that is a case of not doing it, it is not a case of not being able to do it. Therefore your Majesty's not exercising the royal sway, is not such a case as that of taking the Tai mountain under your arm, and leaping over the north sea with it. Your Majesty's not exercising the royal sway is a case like that of breaking off a branch from a tree. Treat with the reverence due to age the elders in your own family, so that the elders in the families of others shall be similarly treated; treat with the kindness due to youth the young in your own family, so that the young in the families of others shall be similarly treated - do this, and the kingdom may be made to go round in your palm. It is said in the Book of Poetry, "His example affected his wife. It reached to his brothers, and his family of the State was governed by it." The language shows how king Wen simply took his kindly heart, and exercised it towards those parties. Therefore the carrying out his kindness of heart by a prince will suffice for the love and protection of all within the four seas, and if he do not carry it out, he will not be able to protect his wife and children. The way in which the ancients came greatly to surpass other men, was no other but this - simply that they knew well how to carry out, so as to affect others, what they themselves did. Now your kindness is sufficient to reach to animals, and no benefits are extended from it to reach the people. How is this? Is an exception to be made here? By weighing, we know what things are light, and what heavy. By measuring, we know what things are long, and what short. The relations of all things may be thus determined, and it is of the greatest importance to estimate the motions of the mind. I beg your Majesty to measure it. You collect your equipments of war, endanger your soldiers and officers, and excite the resentment of the other princes - do these things cause you pleasure in your mind?'

Mencius replied, 'Suppose you were asked to tuck the Tai mountain under your arm and leap over the north sea with it. If you told people, "I cannot do it," you would truly be unable to do it. Now suppose a superior ordered you to break a branch off a tree. If you told people, "I cannot do it," you would be refusing, not unable. So your Majesty's failure to rule as a true king is not like carrying the Tai mountain over the north sea. Your failure is like not breaking a branch off a tree. Treat the elders in your own family with respect, and extend that respect to elders in other families. Treat the young in your own family with kindness, and extend that kindness to the young in other families. Do this, and you can make the kingdom turn in the palm of your hand. The Book of Poetry says, "His example influenced his wife. It reached his brothers, and through it his family and the State were governed." These words show how king Wen simply extended his kind heart to these people. So a ruler need only extend his kindness to love and protect everyone within the four seas. If he does not extend his kindness, he will be unable to protect his wife and children. The ancients far surpassed other people for this reason alone. They knew well how to extend their own conduct to influence others. Now your kindness reaches animals, yet none of its benefits reach the people. Why is this? Should the people be an exception? By weighing things, we learn what is light and what is heavy. By measuring things, we learn what is long and what is short. We can judge the relationships between all things in this way. Above all, we must assess the workings of our minds. I ask your Majesty to examine your own mind. You gather military equipment, endanger your soldiers and officers, and stir up resentment among the other princes. Do these things bring you pleasure?'

The king replied, 'No. How should I derive pleasure from these things? My object in them is to seek for what I greatly desire.'

The king replied, 'No. How could I take pleasure in these things? I pursue them to seek what I most desire.'

Mencius said, 'May I hear from you what it is that you greatly desire?' The king laughed and did not speak.

Mencius said, 'May I ask what you want so much?' The king laughed and said nothing.

Mencius resumed, 'Are you led to desire it, because you have not enough of rich and sweet food for your mouth? Or because you have not enough of light and warm clothing for your body? Or because you have not enough of beautifully coloured objects to delight your eyes? Or because you have not voices and tones enough to please your ears? Or because you have not enough of attendants and favourites to stand before you and receive your orders? Your Majesty's various officers are sufficient to supply you with those things. How can your Majesty be led to entertain such a desire on account of them?'

Mencius continued, 'Do you desire it because you lack enough rich, sweet food to satisfy your mouth? Or because you lack enough light, warm clothing for your body? Or because you lack enough beautifully colored things to delight your eyes? Or because you lack enough voices and music to please your ears? Or because you lack enough attendants and favorites to stand before you and take your orders? Your Majesty's officials can supply you with all these things. How could a lack of these things lead Your Majesty to have such a desire?'

'No,' said the king; 'my desire is not on account of them.'

'No,' said the king. 'My desire is not because of them.'

Mencius added, 'Then, what your Majesty greatly desires may be known. You wish to enlarge your territories, to have Qin and Chu wait at your court, to rule the Middle Kingdom, and to attract to you the barbarous tribes that surround it. But doing what you do to seek for what you desire is like climbing a tree to seek for fish.'

Mencius added, 'Then we can see what your Majesty wants most. You want to expand your territory and have Qin and Chu attend your court. You want to rule the Middle Kingdom and draw the surrounding barbarian tribes to you. But seeking what you want through your current actions is like climbing a tree to look for fish.'

The king said, 'Is it so bad as that?'

The king said, 'Is it that bad?'

'It is even worse,' was the reply. 'If you climb a tree to seek for fish, although you do not get the fish, you will not suffer any subsequent calamity. But doing what you do to seek for what you desire, doing it moreover with all your heart, you will assuredly afterwards meet with calamities.'

'It is even worse,' came the reply. 'If you climb a tree to look for fish, you will not suffer any disaster afterward, even if you catch none. But you are pursuing what you want through your current actions, and doing so with all your heart. You will certainly suffer disasters afterward.'

The king asked, 'May I hear from you the proof of that?'

The king asked, 'Could you give me proof of that?'

Mencius said, 'If the people of Zou should fight with the people of Chu, which of them does your Majesty think would conquer?'

Mencius said, 'Your Majesty, if the people of Zou fought the people of Chu, who do you think would win?'

'The people of Chu would conquer.'

'The people of Chu would win.'

'Yes - and so it is certain that a small country cannot contend with a great, that few cannot contend with many, that the weak cannot contend with the strong. The territory within the four seas embraces nine divisions, each of a thousand li square. All Qi together is but one of them. If with one part you try to subdue the other eight, what is the difference between that and Zou's contending with Chu? For, with such a desire, you must turn back to the proper course for its attainment. Now if your Majesty will institute a government whose action shall be benevolent, this will cause all the officers in the kingdom to wish to stand in your Majesty's court, and all the farmers to wish to plough in your Majesty's fields, and all the merchants, both travelling and stationary, to wish to store their goods in your Majesty's market-places, and all travelling strangers to wish to make their tours on your Majesty's roads, and all throughout the kingdom who feel aggrieved by their rulers to wish to come and complain to your Majesty. And when they are so bent, who will be able to keep them back?'

'Yes, so a small country certainly cannot compete with a large one, nor can the few compete with the many. The weak cannot compete with the strong. The land within the four seas contains nine regions, each a thousand li square. All of Qi makes up just one of those regions. If you try to conquer the other eight with just one, how is that different from Zou fighting Chu? So, if you want to achieve your goal, you must return to the right way of pursuing it. Now, if your Majesty establishes a benevolent government, all officials in the kingdom will want to serve at your court. All farmers will want to plough your fields. All merchants, both travelling and settled, will want to store their goods in your marketplaces. All travellers from elsewhere will want to travel on your roads. And everyone throughout the kingdom who feels wronged by their rulers will want to bring their complaints to your Majesty. When all these people are so determined, who will be able to hold them back?'

The king said, 'I am stupid, and not able to advance to this. I wish you, my Master, to assist my intentions. Teach me clearly; although I am deficient in intelligence and vigour, I will essay and try to carry your instructions into effect.'

The king said, 'I am foolish and unable to reach this point. My Master, I ask you to help me achieve my aims. Teach me clearly. Although I lack intelligence and energy, I will try to put your instructions into practice.'

Mencius replied, 'They are only men of education, who, without a certain livelihood, are able to maintain a fixed heart. As to the people, if they have not a certain livelihood, it follows that they will not have a fixed heart. And if they have not a fixed heart, there is nothing which they will not do, in the way of self-abandonment, of moral deflection, of depravity, and of wild license. When they thus have been involved in crime, to follow them up and punish them - this is to entrap the people. How can such a thing as entrapping the people be done under the rule of a benevolent man? Therefore an intelligent ruler will regulate the livelihood of the people, so as to make sure that, for those above them, they shall have sufficient wherewith to serve their parents, and, for those below them, sufficient wherewith to support their wives and children; that in good years they shall always be abundantly satisfied, and that in bad years they shall escape the danger of perishing. After this he may urge them, and they will proceed to what is good, for in this case the people will follow after it with ease. Now, the livelihood of the people is so regulated, that, above, they have not sufficient wherewith to serve their parents, and, below, they have not sufficient wherewith to support their wives and children. Notwithstanding good years, their lives are continually embittered, and, in bad years, they do not escape perishing. In such circumstances they only try to save themselves from death, and are afraid they will not succeed. What leisure have they to cultivate propriety and righteousness? If your Majesty wishes to effect this regulation of the livelihood of the people, why not turn to that which is the essential step to it? Let mulberry-trees be planted about the homesteads with their five mu, and persons of fifty years may be clothed with silk. In keeping fowls, pigs, dogs, and swine, let not their times of breeding be neglected, and persons of seventy years may eat flesh. Let there not be taken away the time that is proper for the cultivation of the farm with its hundred mu, and the family of eight mouths that is supported by it shall not suffer from hunger. Let careful attention be paid to education in schools, the inculcation in it especially of the filial and fraternal duties, and grey-haired men will not be seen upon the roads, carrying burdens on their backs or on their heads. It never has been that the ruler of a State where such results were seen, the old wearing silk and eating flesh, and the black-haired people suffering neither from hunger nor cold, did not attain to the royal dignity.'

Mencius replied, 'Only educated people can remain morally steady without a secure livelihood. Ordinary people cannot remain morally steady if they have no secure livelihood. Without that steadiness, there is no limit to their recklessness, wrongdoing, corruption, and unchecked behavior. Once they have fallen into crime, pursuing and punishing them is to trap the people. How could a compassionate ruler allow the people to be trapped? So a wise ruler will ensure that the people have secure livelihoods. They must have enough to care for their parents and support their wives and children. In good years, they must always have plenty. In bad years, they must be safe from starvation. After securing their livelihoods, the ruler may urge them toward goodness. The people will then find it easy to follow that path. But as livelihoods are managed now, people lack enough to care for their parents or support their wives and children. Even in good years, their lives are full of hardship. In bad years, they do not escape starvation. In these circumstances, they struggle only to stay alive, fearing they will fail. What time do they have to learn proper conduct and righteousness? If your Majesty wishes to secure the people's livelihoods, why not begin with the essential step? Let mulberry trees be planted around homesteads of five mu, so people aged fifty may wear silk. When raising chickens, pigs, dogs, and swine, do not neglect their breeding seasons, so people aged seventy may eat meat. Do not take away the time needed to cultivate a farm of a hundred mu. Then the family of eight supported by that farm will not go hungry. Give careful attention to education in schools, especially to teaching duties toward parents and older siblings. Then gray-haired people will not be seen on the roads carrying loads on their backs or heads. No ruler of a State with such conditions has ever failed to become a true king. In such a State, the old wear silk and eat meat, and the black-haired people suffer neither hunger nor cold.'